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Deja Vu? (re: "Spoils of war")

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2002 2:55 pm    Post subject: Deja Vu? (re: "Spoils of war") Reply with quote

I recently got an IRC message that indicated JG is going through another Officially sanctioned "Player organized Event" with wide implications (read: real dynamic content introduced deus ex machina fashion)
    funny enough, Russian decided to invoke my name while complaining of arbitrary actions by GMs happened to forget his squad was a co-conspirator on the Amananth production ceasation many moons ago

and for those idjits who think it's cool to say this was an old topic before it began, lemmie remind you what i do best: What muffy assumes russian was talking about or would it be this one (pretty sure it's the latter, cause Russian was a n00b when the former occurred)
    even though i think invoking muffy's services in vain is silly when one was responsible for setting up an earlier "horrendous" event, i'll still humor Russian's wish to see farther back to a more "innocent" time...

BTW, i've repaired the links for the amananth backstory in this forum

Last edited by MajorFreak on Tue Dec 31, 2002 9:51 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2002 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

omg. i don't even want to bother with the semantic clarification going on..makes me vomit. You seriously think the barraks being produced elsewhere than Hyperial makes any sort of sense? Either barraks are produced, or they are not. distribution is a JOKE. a JOKE. do you seriously expect me to swallow this "new development" in the lackluster storyline as anything other than a developer nerfed decision??
  1. if something is produced it gets disseminated everywhere...even with the low pop we have, it's ALWAYS been a buyer's market. see here
  2. the only time something really matters is if it's production is stymied by hook (bug) or crook (deliberate dev coding)
If it's #1 case then it's IRRELEVANT to the persistence of the MMOG. Okay, so you say, "why?" Well, that's easy. ask yourselves what role a "sense of community" plays in a MMOG. any mmog. the answer will be, unless yer retarded, "a sense of contribution"...Contribution means sacrifice - means honour - means everything. fuck profit. seriously. WE PAY NETDEVIL, they don't pay us. credits ultimately mean fuck all. fuck all.

Therefore, my personal opinion of this crock of shiite has been, since i heard about it, irrelevant. (no impact on gameplay period. therefore it's just like 95% of what goes on in jumpgate...non persistent, non-real dynamic content deux ex machina crapola that won't change one iota of persistence. period.)
    persistence = Dynamic Real Content; Something that actually impacts everyone's personal storyline and sense of community...for good or ill; not some new patch shiite in a 24/7 server that effects ZERO gameplay fer christ's sakes. Might as well change the colour of amananth sectors to fuschia instead of pink fer fuck's sakes. That's NOT what i call "history" in a supposedly persistent universe. (why the hell do you think i've never recorded a single instance of "conflux storyline" in that "storyline" forum of ours here??!!!!)
In fact, this 'Barraks licensing' storyline is less than's not even worth recording in anything BUT the flame war section.

ND plot discussion thread
some interesting comments that aren't new and have been hashed about for eons. (basicially, the gist is that no matter how cloudy the backstory is, GM_Moll is faced with creating a backstory day by day...we ARE creating history)

Where this approach falls flat on it's face is when Ambrosius KO's NetDevil's storyline with this:
Ambrosius wrote:
I'm sure people are tired of hearing about how wonder Eve is/will be. But I really think Themis/ND should take a page out of their book. Look at the attention to detail and the depth of the backstory there. I'm not saying we should do that, but perhaps JOSSH should be get some backstory updates as the story unfolds. It also ought to include a timeline and an area where current events are documented in "storyline" categories -- something easier to find and read than wading through news archives.

Simply? hands down, it's the fact that GM_Moll took everything "official", including stuff handed down by G_Bob, and ran with it...unfortunately, G_Bob really fucked up when it came to the "GVB wars" since he came up with the pea-brained idea that the GVB war was recent history...therefore, GM_Moll was stuck with a betaquality ND biblio database and the (now deleted) PJG authorized "Fiction" FAQ that was G_Bob making shit up on the fly. period. (actually, his whole fucking Fiction FAQ was bullshit when you think about it)

What we have currently is GM_Moll having to both flesh out AND repair damage done by G_bob. (which isn't a total wreck. it just kinda hurts when NetDevil hasn't fucking updated the biblio sections since beta days. assholes)

For those of you a bit confused by this, note that until GM_Moll confirmed G-bob's version as "officially official" we didn't take his update of the beta-quality database seriously. TO WIT, there was the old version that said the "gvb wars" were like 2000+ years ago (ie. no fucking #1 or #2...just "wars" period.)...then we got G_Bob making stuff up on the fly and thinking he was doing us a favour by "updating" and "clarifying" the jossh database.

What we got instead was a jossh database that has never been updated (though i'm sure ND will produced semantic evidence of bush-beating) B_Bob aborted update that never really got off the ground (ie. he was laid-off shortly after his "storyline FAQ" thread got started)
    personally, i accepted GM_Moll's POV and swallowed the "2nd GVB wars" as an intriguing plot though past history has been repressed from "official" channels and needs to be introduced there's an *IC* aversion to the free flow of information (for those who don't care a fig for backstory, I'LL REPEAT THE FACT there's no official jossh documentation of the '2nd GVB war' until g-bob happily announced on the beta forums that the gvb wars happened 15 years ago instead of the official 2000+ years)
    [read: he was a Lum the Mad writer. go figure. arrogant cynical twat
    which gets back to Ambrosius' point. GM_Moll has been crippled from the very start by this conspiratorial storytelling narrative POV forced on her by the lazy, inefficient and downright fucking apathetic dev team who never bothered to address the discrepancies between G-bob's fuckups and their typos. (ie. "hey! it's only some BS story. who gives a fuck till next patch, right?")

    If you want my final final analysis i think these punks owning NetDevil have alot of cash from the "dot-com" era and are perfectly willing to create a niche-market PK-heaven game because they figure it'll eventually develop a rich and very complex backstory...a backstory built on the trials and tribulations of folks like YOU (not me, i've quit) who operate with zero background compared to rich environments like Eve
there's only so much cash NetDevil has...Let's pray they have enough. i'd hate to have wasted so much of my time on someone's wet dream PK wank fest only to see it die still-borne.

Last edited by MajorFreak on Tue Dec 31, 2002 9:16 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2002 11:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ewwwwwww...looks like the recent RP storyline took a leap off the deep end. seems as though they used the same mechanism as before and transported imaginary people in TOWs. owie.

Jeezuz. we're talking dead ringer for the olde Knights Cheval rescue attempt down to the brass tacks.

Okay, a few questions arise now that the dust has settled on the flame wars
  1. how much did this character impact recent history and future events?
  2. how much of this dude's background reveal the larger picture?
  3. did anything new arise that challenged our assumption of basic JG "laws"?
To the above questions i presuppose the fact it was just a flash in the pan; Yet another talking head i'm guessing...I'll be sure to read up on it just in case, but that's my final answer.

Last edited by MajorFreak on Tue Dec 31, 2002 9:08 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2002 11:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

w00t! i did find something...looks like Spork's working up a lather
ND general forum thread
Spork wrote:
We like RPing. We hate being left out of the script.

Even though it may not be as realistic, errors should be made on the side of giving out too much information to too many people instead of the current cloak and dagger stuff that goes on with 1 or 2 pilots "in the know."

Information and background needs to be redily avalible for anyone looking to join RP events. Purple text and event f5's should be used more. It seems for some reason that all RP only takes place in f3. This may make it more "real" but it really limits who all can watch. It makes it very tough to coordinate forces in multiple sectors (or inside/outside stations) if the cheif RPCs are unwilling to use f5.

RP events either need to be much more common (with a fair number held during non-US peak hours) and/or need to be advertised very throughly through JOSSH news "leaks." It seems so often that 1 or 2 pilots "in the know" and sometimes their squad or 2 or 3 fortunate onlookers are the only ones who get to play along.
For example, consider sent attacks. They are now so common, that there is no need to make large announcements in purple. Word spreads in game quickly. You don't have to be in the right spot at the right time in the right ship config to play along.

AS new RPCs are often introduced, they have agendas, as they should ICly. They could be spies, traitors, patriots, trustworthy, or untrustworthy...whatever. But, there is no real IC way to know if you can trust a RPC. There's no IC background checks that you can make (as you would be able to in an advanced society) w/o bugging Moll with a hundered e-mails. So, the more mysterious the RPC, the less I as a player know how to react ICly. Again, I advocate erring on the side of too much information for the sake of a historically rich univers than a "realistic" one where no one knows what's going on and why.

PvPers want to RP too. At least some of us do. It seems that most of the RP time goes toward the fluxers. Why aren't there fairly frequent RP events like this:
Hyperial hires the Octs to escort a HSS tow moving item X from LL to Hyp. Quantar finds out and wants to destroy or capture item X. Solrains either help the Octs for a fee or want to capture the item to sell to Quantar. The RP doesn't have to be deep story-arc stuff every time. Just a search and destroy (or escort and protect) tow X as he travels between Y and Z.
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